Ep. 122 – Why Connection Through Discipline is So Important with Chad Hayenga

by | April 7, 2022

Ep. 122 – Why Connection Through Discipline is So Important with Chad Hayenga

by | April 7, 2022

The Fresh Start Family Show
The Fresh Start Family Show
Ep. 122 - Why Connection Through Discipline is So Important with Chad Hayenga
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Today on the Fresh Start Family Terry and Wendy have a conversation with Chad Hayenga from the Connected Families team to talk about why building connection through discipline is so essential to create healthy, strong parent-child relationships and how families can achieve it in their homes. 

Chad & the Connected Families Framework helps parents to use three foundational principles: 

Connect, Coach & Correct … 

… as the guideline for discipline & parenting to make sure through everything, even the most challenging of situations, mistakes & misbehavior … that our kids understand they are known, loved & enjoyed.

This conversation will help families find connection through discipline by teaching them:

  1. The Connected Families Model: Connect, Coach & Correct
  2. What connected discipline looks like
  3. Why connected discipline “works”
  4. What it actually means when it is “working”

Want to learn how to discipline with compassion, connection, and firm kindness?

Click HERE to save your seat!


Episode Highlights:

  • Chad’s background & why he became a parenting coach
  • Connected Families Model
  • What is connected discipline?
  • Knowing who we are in Christ 
  • Building connection through discipline
  • How to connect, coach & THEN correct
  • What it really means for something to “work” for your family
  • Success stories using the CF model

Resources Mentioned:

Connected Families – Discipline that Connects with Your Child’s Heart BOOK – Audio Version

Connected Families on Facebook

Connected Families on Instagram

Connected Families on Pinterest

Connected Families on Twitter

Perspectives on Spanking – FREE ebook

Discipline That Connects Course
Discipline That Connects with Your Child’s Heart book

Fresh Start Family Episodes with Connected Families:

FSF Episode 43 – Understanding your Sensitive or Intense Child 

FSF Episode 59 – How to Make Discipline Both Compassionate and Effective

FSF Episode 60 – Navigating Doubts and Triggers for Dads


Not able to listen or want to read along with us?

Here is the episode transcript!


This episode is brought to you by the free, fresh start family firm and kind compassionate discipline learning guide and worksheet. You can grab your copy freshstartfamilyonline.com/disciplineguide.

Wendy:

Well, hello listeners. I’m so happy. You are here for a new episode of the fresh start family show. I am your host, Wendy Snyder, positive parenting educator and family life coach and on today’s show. Terry and I are chatting with Chad Hayenga from connected families to talk about the importance of staying connected to your kids through discipline.


Chad has spent over 25 years ministering to kids and families as a licensed marriage and family therapist, certified life coach speaker, and podcast podcaster. And he’s also an incredible father of three who just loves asking significant questions, bringing God’s grace and truth to life and helping parents have aha moments in coaching sessions and workshops. He has helped. Thousands of parents learn to be more peaceful, purposeful, and confident. Now family compassionate discipline is one of my favorite topics to teach on, to talk about and to equip families, to feel confident about because I truly believe it has the power to change the world.


You’ll hear me talking about it a lot over on Instagram this month, and I’ll also be teaching a free workshop all this month, where you can learn how to build up a compassionate discipline toolkit, and how to design effective logical consequences that work. Can I get a heck? Yes, you can join me with that for that free workshop. If you’re interested over at fresh start family, online.com forward slash discipline, but it’s just so clear to me. You guys, that when we have fear force dominance, overpowering pain, intimidation, and shame as a major tool to influence small humans to comply, I’m talking about traditional punishment.


It is going to radiate out into the world and have massive detrimental effects as these kids become adults now in a world where war and political unrest and just intense, intense health arguments, a divorce, depression, anxiety, suicide, mass shootings. We just had one yesterday again, here in America, as I was preparing this intro addiction, homelessness, there just there’s. These types of things are just such massive and major problems.


It just makes so much sense to me that if we can change the way we discipline children and focus on teaching and connection and empowerment, unconditional love, and actually teaching life skills over punishment, shame, and inflicting pain on small developing human souls. I believe we can truly change the world. As mother Teresa said, when she accepted her Nobel peace prize in 1972, when asked, what can we do to promote world peace? She answered spread love everywhere you go. First of all in your own house.


So this episode is so special to me because obviously the subject of compassionate discipline is a deep passion of mine. And I just admire the team at connected families and the ministry they’ve created so deeply. Now, if you don’t know about connected families, yet they are a nonprofit ministry that cares for inspires and equips parents to receive and pass on God’s grace and truth by imparting a biblical memorable transformational framework for parenting. We’ve had their founders, Jim and Lynn Jackson on the show. Many, many times the first one was with Lynn. The episode was 43, understanding your intense or unique child.


We’ll make sure we put all these links in the show notes for you guys. The second episode was episode 59 with both Jim and Lynn, how to make discipline both compassionate and effective. And then episode 60 was just with Jim and Terry for the dads, navigating doubts and triggers for dads. And now we get to have Chad on the show. Who’s another integral part of the connected families team. But before we get started, I wanted to talk to you about the faith based messages you hear often. And especially this month here at fresh start family, because you guys did it’s Easter vibe where we get to celebrate the resurrection of Jesus.


And it’s literally my favorite holiday of the year because it represents new life, a fresh start and just a complete surrender to and celebration of God. Now I want to talk just for a minute about the faith component and remind you what we stand for here at fresh chart family. We are a Jesus loving and honoring family who founded fresh start family to bring light to the world. So of course, yes, we worshiped Jesus and looked at him in all of our days and ways. And it’s so important for me to make sure you know, that every family of every faith is welcome here at the fresh start table.


I truly aim to design, to design episodes that serve families of all faiths, because I want parents who don’t know Jesus or don’t see him or hear her at him, or just aren’t in relationship with him every day. I want them. I want you, if that’s you to see him and every thing we do here and not in the preachy, weird in your face kind of way. I believe that what we talk about here on the fresh start family show is universal. When it comes to honoring God and honoring all human beings, young and old, small and big, we have a manifesto that we like to stand by when it comes to inclusion. And it goes like this, by the way, this was originally written by Lindsay letters who I just love so much.


I have so much of her artwork and I just admire her so, so much, make sure you go check her out on Instagram and just, you know, get to know her story. And yeah, I just love her, but I’ve made some additions to this. Also it goes like this.

If you are searching, saved black brown, white gay, straight, sure. Unsure older, younger peace filled pain filled able-bodied or differently abled, no matter how many moms or dads or divorces or kids or chromosomes or failures or successes or questions you have no matter your gender or status or religion or where you come from.
Know that you are welcome here.

I just love that. But whether you are a believer in Jesus or not listeners, this conversation about staying connected to your kids through discipline will serve you immensely. So first off, if you’re not a believer, I hope you’ll find comfort in knowing that what you hear or have seen in the air quotes Christian world, or by some again, air quotes, Christian political figures, or some famous pasture pastors, or just your crazy aunt Mary or ignoring cousin. Who’s the creepy kind of Christian who always talked to you in a condescending tone, mostly about how you’re going to hell.


If you don’t repent or the de determined elder in your church that keeps telling you that you just need to spank your kids already. If you really want to make them fear, God, if you seen or had these kinds of people in your life who literally makes you want to run from religion, I hope you’ll find comfort in hearing that this isn’t always the way it is. We as Christians really do stand for compassion and grace and humility and self-control and peace and love and unity and connection. I know I personally have had so many friends and family members who have left the church or completely turned away from religion because they were, were pulsed by the ways of religion or even experienced religious trauma.


So I want to just honor those of you who are listening and have any of those experiences or thoughts you make sense to me and I, to myself have been absolutely heartbroken over how so many, who claim to be Christ followers act and what they advocate for. And it can just be really hard to understand. So naturally rejection can happen, but I hope getting to know us here at fresh sharp family and getting to know ministries like connected families might just open your heart a bit and help you always remember that. What is loudest in the world isn’t necessarily what truly represents the Christian faith, especially not the ways of Jesus. Yes. You’ll hear his name, John Jesus a lot because we freaking love him.


And we’re celebrating a big time this month, but you’ll also hear us just have incredible conversations about connection, honest honor, and legacy. When it comes to raising little souls and being in respectful, honoring relationships with other humans. Now, if you’re a believer, I pray this episode fills your heart with confidence that you can do things different than some of your family, church members, friends, or neighbors who have told you. You have to in order to honor God, Chad just shares so many great insights is so wise and has such a big heart. And I know you’re going to love listening to him and hearing from him so much.


I know. So, so so many families who are of Christian faith have been told that the Bible commands you to use corporal punishment. And if you don’t, you will raise kids who don’t respect God or others. We’re here to tell you, you don’t. I pray that you’ll find so much inspiration and hope. And this month, this month’s episodes, especially this one, that there are just so many resources available for you. If you want to learn how to discipline your kids in a way that builds connection and respect without hurting them. And also that 1 million reasons that hurting your kids or making them feel worse in order to teach them to pave better.


It’s just not an option. And doesn’t even work. Air quotes, work long-term to raise healthy human beings. I also pray that you’ll share this episode and all the episodes this month freely on your social channels and via email text, or on the block. When you’re hanging out with neighbors, I pray that these episodes will help you stand tall for what you believe in as a family, when it comes to teaching your kids and raising good kind, God loving humans. So without further ado, let’s jump into this beautiful conversation about how to stay connected to your kids through discipline. It’s just so darn important. And I’m so happy that you are here listening.


Thank you so much for caring so much about your children, about your family. See you. I admire you and I’m over here cheering you on. So families go find connected families [email protected] Make sure you check out all of the incredible resources they have to support you. Their book, a discipline that connects with your child’s heart is great place to start, and they have it available in an audio version. You guys know how much I love to listen to books on audio. It just makes it so easy to get them done. Kind of on the go, which as parents we’re always on the go, right? They’re also very active over on Instagram and their handle is at connected fans.


So without further ado, please help me welcome Chad Hyenger to the show.

Stella:
Well, Hey there, I’m Stella. Welcome to my mom and dad’s podcast. The fresh start family show. We’re so happy you’re here. We’re inspired by the ocean, Jesus and rock and roll and believe deeply in the true power of loving kindness together. We hope to inspire you to expand your heart, learn new tools and strengthen your family. Enjoy the show.

Wendy:
Well, Hey there, families and welcome to a new episode of the fresh start family show. We are so happy that you are here and we are so excited to welcome Chad Hyenga from connected families. Welcome Chad to the show. Okay.

Chad:
Hey, oh man. Thank you so much for having me.

Wendy:
Oh, we are so pumped to have this conversation with you today. Listeners, we are going to be talking about why connection through discipline is so key and we’ve had this conversation on the books for quite some time and I’ve just kind of been just praying into what God wants to, you know, have us bring to the table in this conversation. And I’ve been blessed with some questions and some topics that I think are going to be really good for us, but listeners, let me give you kind of an overview of what this discussion is going to look like today and then we’ll get started. So Chad is going to talk to us about what the connected families model looks like. We just cannot say enough great things about connected families.


We love you guys so much. I advocate for your work and your ministry to everyone who can, who can hear me speak about it. We’ll talk about why connection during discipline is so important. What connected discipline actually looks like. We’ll talk about why it works so well in air quotes and we’ll even talk about what works means. And then yes. And then also we’ll talk about how to respond to our brothers and sisters in Christ who still maybe perhaps think that hurting children is really what godly action looks like. And then Chad might, maybe you can even share some success stories with us at the end, from your students, but let’s get started Chad with just tell us a little bit about yourself.


I know you’re a licensed therapist, but you’re also a coach and you do so much work with connected families. So tell us about your journey, how you got to where you are, why you’re so passionate about what you do. We’ve had Jim and Lynne many times on the show, but we we’ve never heard your story. So tell us all about it.

Chad:
Yeah. Well, thanks for having me again. And you know, I came to parenting with kind of some preset expectations that my kids would listen to everything I said, and then they would have the yes, yes sir. Yes. Dad kind of mentality and yeah, just really looking for obedience as a primary driver, a primary goal. And, and it worked for a little bit, again, air quotes on, worked in that I was getting what I wanted and then I didn’t get what I wanted after a little bit of time. Like, wait a second, something’s got to be wrong here. Now with me, this child or these kids.


No, no, I kind of have this down. Right. And, and ultimately it came to a place where it’s like I was demanding right behavior from my kids. I was really sacrificing my relationship in a lot of ways to get it. And at the end of the day, I neither had a right behaving or well-behaved child for a relationship with that child. And I was concurrently while my kids were young working in a youth outreach organization with some at-risk teens. And I was learning a lot about how to develop relationships with someone who was kind of mistrusting of adults.


And if they felt some sense of shame or condemnation towards them, they would be gone. And it was really important for us to, to develop connections. So we spent a lot of time connecting with these kids and yet it took me awhile to recognize that what I was doing with other people’s kids, it really challenging situations. I wasn’t actually offering that to my own kids. I was offering plenty of grace and mercy over here while not allowing that or offering it over here. And that started to convict me a little bit. And Jim Jackson and I have worked together since 1995. We were both working at the same organization, learning a lot together.


They started connecting families, Jim and Lynn in 2002, I joined in 2005 and at that time was really working through kind of how do I, I knew that I, I was working with kids with teens and that was okay, but I really wanted to work with parents and families. And so I went back and got my master’s in counseling psychology. I’m a licensed marriage and family therapist. I also got my certification in coaching and life coaching at that time as well. And I started to work at connected families. We used to have a counseling arm. And so I was a counselor as a therapist with teens primarily. And again, I, I just felt this knowing and me like I was helping kids kind of cope with their parents.


I was like, wait a second. I don’t think I want to do this forever. And so that was a, a discovery time for me, but a frustrating time because parents were more than willing to drop their kids off to be fixed by the expert. And, and so started to, to get a little bit, yeah, just discouraged by that. And, you know, therapists, teen therapists really important, right? So not saying that that’s not the case, but, but for me that just, wasn’t going to be a lifetime passion. And so our family actually took a year off and we went to Mexico and did a year long service project in Mexico, Mexico. My daughters were 11th, eighth and fourth grade.


And I, I say my wife, you know, my wife’s Brazilian. So taking Portuguese into Spanish, she was adapting. My kids all knew Spanish. They went through a Spanish immersion program. I’m German, right. I was like, oh my gosh, what am I doing here? So anyway, we did that came back to connected families in 2013. And I’ve just been parent coaching and speaking on some parenting topics and looking through that lens of the connected families framework since then. And I think I’ve helped. I’ve helped far more kids by helping their parents than I ever did by just working with kids because parents, we have such influence. Okay. And I just want to contrast that with control.


Okay. We have a lot of influence and how we use our influence, how we communicate to our kids, especially when they’re struggling impacts identity. And that identity is something that we started to shift, focus on from getting right behavior, to really training up an identity in our kids about who they really are. And when we, what we believe about ourselves is what we walk out, what we live out. And so as keepers of a child’s identity, as an influence influencer of that identity, that became a big shift for me to go let’s, let’s work towards that goal, which is actually a goal I have a little bit more control over other than their behavior or their, their tone or their attitude or their, you know, whatever, whatever it might be.


So anyway, that’s just, that’s a little background on how I got to where I am and I love it. I mean, the framework has changed everything, you know, just, just everything in terms of how I look at even important relationships with adults, it’s connected families, really how we look through the lens of relating to each other as staff, and we know what are those relationships going to look like and how does the framework inform those relationships?

Wendy:
Oh, so good. So good. And how old are your daughters now?

Chad:
Yeah, they’re all in their twenties. So my youngest just turned 20 this past year. And so we’re in a new age and stage of, of parenting. And we just did a recently, I think we did a podcast on our podcast about just adult kids. Right. How does the framework look, you know, looking through the lens of the framework with adult kids, so that it’s a new and interesting journey that we’re on into the next phase of parenting.

Wendy:
So cool. And, and it is so true. Right. But it, it it’s like, you know, yes. It’s parenting that we talk so much about, but it really is in all relationships, whether it’s adult kids or your, your team, right. Like, and I watch the way connected families runs their team and the way they relate to their staff and take care of their staff. There was a day where I emailed and, you know, we were back and forth and planning stuff and they were like, you know what? We’re on a rest day, we have a rest day this week. We’re not doing any work. It was either like three days or two days or one day. I don’t know when it was, but I was like, oh my gosh, I can just feel that, that what you guys teach carries into everything you do, whether it’s your marriage, your kids, your the way you run your teams.


And yeah, it’s man, it’s so good to hear your story. And I knew I was gonna have emotion today. Cause I’m just, it just feels like such an honor to be in the presence of especially men who are doing this work and advocating for it because, you know, we all know, like there’s just such an absence of this in the Christian world. And it, and I, you know, I spend a lot of days with like heartbreak about it and I just get so overwhelmed with joy when I’m in the presence of somebody that is spreading this light and helping families in this capacity. And then to be with two men that are doing that. It’s just like, there’s a lot of, you know, there’s more girls in this space, but to have like these strong men who stand for compassion and grace and connection and humility and all the things that Jesus did, I’m just like I feel like the luckiest girl in the world today. So,

Well, Hey there families, I pausing this episode for a quick minute to ask you if you would be interested in learning more about how to design healthy, effective from, and kind logical consequences when your kids misbehave or make mistakes. Awesome. I see. So many of you nodding your heads. Yes, yes, yes. Cool. Well, you’re in luck because I’ve designed a free learning guide about how to do exactly that you can head to freshstartfamilyonline.com/discipline guide to grab your free download.

Terry:
I just love to cause like, you know, most people who are listening to this podcast, I think have some level of curiosity or some little thing tugging at them on the inside saying, I want more than just okay. Or I want to, I want to do something that is truly lasting or they’re desiring this connection. And I love cause you, you described that both in your professional walk and your walk to of there was always something pulling you because you probably would have been just okay, if you would’ve just kind of said, oh, okay, here’s the blueprint. I’m just going to stick with this. I’m going to stay.

Wendy:
I’m going to stick with this.

Terry:
Yeah. This format of the, the job that I’m in or this kind of blueprint of parenting. Oh, okay. We might just be okay with that. But there was something pulling at you. So I, I just, I just, I just want to thank the families who are tuning in right now, because I feel like there’s something pulling at you. You want more for your relationships in your family dynamic and possibly even your professional work too. And so I just love to, I just loved your story because there were, you kept going, you kept going and you knew that there was something else out there. And so I just think that it’s beautiful. So yeah. Thank you

Wendy:
So good. Okay. Well, let’s get into it. Chad, talk to us, let’s just start off with connected families model. So again, we’ve had Jim and Lynn on, they’ve told us about this, but tell us again, what is the outline of kind of what you guys teach and discipline is a component of that, right? Like we’re talking so much about discipline and we have some really good questions at the end that I really want to bring to the table because I feel like a lot of listeners here, I, the majority of listeners, I realized they’re, they’re pretty, they’re on board, right? Like they’re like, yes, my heart is open. It’s calling me. And there’s just still so much like a lack of confidence when brothers and sisters of Christ, like, they’re like, ah, you got it totally wrong. So we’re going to talk about that in a little bit, but let’s just start off with, could you review that model for us?

Chad:
Yeah. So when we talk about the connected families framework, we’re talking about a pyramid like yeah. W pyramid with really four, four key pieces to it. Right? And the bottom one is a foundation foundation is, is really who are we in Christ? If you read Ephesians chapters one and two, you’ll probably find about 25 to 27. You are statements there. Here’s who we are. Christ believer. It’s not conditional. It is just who we are as an identity. And so knowing who you are, what you believe about yourself, accurate sorts of beliefs, about who we are in Christ allows us then to build our parenting on three other key principles.


And that is connect. So connection at connected families. If it’s in our name, we probably want to know what that means. And for us, that really is our kids understanding that we know them, we love them and we enjoy them what our, what our kids say that they’re known loved and enjoyed by their parents. And these are things that are happening outside of behavior challenges, right? So these are just, just connective sorts of engagements that we want to have with our kids. It could be just a little quick wink, right? It could just be a passing by and a quick shoulder squeeze and Hey, how are you doing it? You know, I don’t know about you, but, but I’ve walked into rooms where I’ve known I’ve been tolerated, right.


Or it’s like, people are like, okay, well that’s Chad kind of thing, but I’ve also walked into rooms where people went, oh my goodness, oh, I’m so glad you’re here. Right? And it’s that, it’s that knowing that loving that enjoying, that we really want to work hard in proactive kinds of ways outside of behavior challenges, communicate to our kids. And then the third is coach and we really want to help our kids grow in the things that God’s gifted them in and affirm them and encourage them to keep going, give them opportunities to, to, to use those strengths in ways that bless and honor other people like bring glory to God and then correction.


So what do we do when our kids get off track and how do we help bring them back into God’s purposes for them? And so out of that, come what we would call the way that that’s really just our framework. But out of that, come these four messages that in discipline challenges, we want to make sure our kids receive from us that are really identity, kind of shaping and forming messages. And parents have good intentions. I have good intentions. I coach with lots of parents and I’ve not met any parent who does not have good goals for their kids. They want them to be respectful. They want them to be kind responsible, caring, right?


All sorts of goals that they would have. But in the midst of misbehavior, oftentimes our messages to our kids are more along the lines of you’re mean or naughty or out of control, or you are an inconvenience to me, that was the biggest one for me is I think I looked at my kids and I, now I look at it, but I think what was I thinking? Right? My kids were an inconvenience to me. Like I had kids to be a convenience convenient, but, but I would send these messages that over time, start to take shape in our kids’ hearts.


And if that’s what they receive from me, then an essence, that’s kind of like, well, then that’s what I’ll be. And when I get really angry, there’s a message to my kids, child. You are in control of my emotions. Like you are. You’re responsible for Mike to caretake my emotional state. Right. And I think that’s the one that really got me where I was thinking, wait, hold a sec, hold on a second. Here. I need my kids to behave well, so I don’t lose it. Right. Who’s in control of who who’s, who’s responsible for me and you. So, so parents will oftentimes have really good goals and not so great messages.


Sometimes I think fear and anxiety drive that like I start PR maybe I’m just projecting a negative future or catastrophizing their future. We don’t get this behavior to stop this kid to meet every day. We need to get this to stop. And we double down on control and that child will oftentimes just be like, no, you’re not going to, you’re not going to control me. And so fear and anxiety. I always encourage parents to take a look at that stress maybe, but often I see parents just don’t have a plan. And that’s what the format is really. I think introduce to families. It’s like, Hey, let’s develop a plan. Now when I ask parents, could you tell me the two or three behavior challenges you’re likely to face this week?


They almost always say, well, of course I say, then why will you act so surprised when you see them? Right? Like why would we be like, what are you doing? It’s like, we know this is coming. And if we know it’s coming, we can start to take, even, even shape our hearts towards that. We can start to develop a plan. How do I want to respond in a way that’s honoring the way that actually grows connection with that child while still holding them accountable. And so the four messages we talk about out of foundation comes to the message child. You are safe with me emotionally, physically, spiritually safe with me. Awesome. I’ll oftentimes hear parents quoting Bible verses to their kids in the midst of anger.


So you’re safe with me emotionally. I can be okay. Even if you’re struggling physically, I’m not intimidating you. My posture is not such that I’m trying to demand behavior over you and kind of intimidate you into behaving a certain way. And I’m, I’m not quoting scripture to try to get you to behave a certain way. Right? We have to teach our kids scripture, but doing it in the middle of their misbehavior is a kind of building a resentment even towards scripture. So that first message you’re safe with me. The big question I have to ask myself and I invite other parents into, can I be okay? Even if my child’s behavior is not okay, or do I need my child to behave well in order for me to be okay, where is my value and okayness coming from?


Okay. And so the next message and that first message yours you’re safe with me is really all parents stuff, right? That’s that’s my work. That’s my work every day. Even as a parent of 20 somethings, I can, I be okay. Even if my kids make choices or decisions, but I’m like, I don’t know about that. Where does my value come from? Secondly, the message out of connect comes this message of child you’re loved no matter what that good behavior, doesn’t earn you more love from me that poor behavior doesn’t subtract love from you from me that the love is a settled issue. That’s the Romans five eight kind of love for while we were still sinners, Christ died for us, just pursuing us with his love, not based on our deserving of that love or lack of deserving of that love.


So empathy is a powerful communicator of your love, no matter what empathy just says. I understand you doesn’t mean, I agree with you. And so that’s the big switch. I think for a lot of parents, it’s like, oh, I can understand somebody. Who’s disappointed that they didn’t get what they wanted right. When they wanted it. Because I felt the same way. Doesn’t mean I have to agree with their tactics or their antics or their big, you know, expression of that. Okay. But I can understand somebody the next one’s coach, coach the message that comes out of coach as child you’re called and capable called to be a blessing. Okay. Really out of the Genesis 12 one through three Abrahamic blessing that Abraham was blessed so that the families of the nations would be blessed.


Right? And so God is God has built families to be a blessing to the nations, to the world. And so the called and then the capable you’re capable of using your good gifts to bless them out of other people. And we talk about a concept called the gift gone awry, or sometimes our kids’ best talents show up in how they misbehave or how they struggle. So have you seen that before where kids get in trouble, I’ll hear, oftentimes people will say my child going to be a lawyer when they grow up, like, yeah. Okay. But you’re saying that in a way that maybe we’re happy about that argue about everything, but really thinking through the lens, how can I affirm the gift I’m seeing and then help create some tracks for that child to use it in healthy ways?


When do we call out the use of that gift when it’s being used? Well, so my stubborn daughter, okay. She’s really determined. And when she gets on the monkey bars and she’s trying to do it or a big sister is doing, and isn’t able to do it, she doesn’t give up. Okay. So when I, when I see that I go, oh my goodness, you’re using that same gift that sometimes you use over here and maybe ways that aren’t so helpful, this is a really great expression. You are very determined. You’re super persistent. I love that about, you know, you don’t give up now when you’re using your stubbornness or determination in ways that aren’t very helpful. I might say, I love that. You’re telling me what you want, how you’re saying that to me right now.


It’s probably not going to get you what you want. So I bet you can do it differently because I’ve seen you do it differently before, right? So there’s this, I found it in your call, them capable a lot of hope that started to rise up in me. I became more hopeful because I started to call out the good things that I was seeing in my kids. And that I was more intentional about helping them use those good gifts to honor. And then the last one is correction. And the message out of correction is the message child. You are responsible for your actions. You’re responsible for your life. And this is the one that most parents want to start with. And I got it, right. It’s why people come really for coaching. They don’t come typically to hear how they can connect better with their kids.


Although I think that would be really great. Some parents do, but really it’s about how do we get the behavior is what parents oftentimes are after. But we talk about the message you’re responsible for your actions. And with think about that really through the lens of building wisdom, like how do we provide if there’s a consequence needed? And they’re oftentimes maybe how do we build wisdom? Is this consequence that this child has experienced right now? Is it building wisdom? And they, are they becoming wiser? Or is this a consequence that is more punitive that might cause them to be more resentment or resentful or might just send them underground?


Right. I just felt like if I got punitive, my kids would get sneakier. They’d be just get better at not getting caught, doing certain things. And so thinking through the lens of wisdom building now, Galatians six, seven says, God, won’t be mocked him and reaps what he sows and our kids need to. And we need to help our kids understand this sewing and reaping principle in Galatians six seven says if you catch someone in sin, those of you who are spiritual should restore that person gently. So what does restoration look like as a, as an end goal for a consequence and then gentle restoration?


What does, what does that look like? As we try to help our kids learn to be responsible for their actions,

Wendy:
So good. Yep. And that mistakes are opportunities to learn, right?

Chad:
Absolutely.

Wendy:
Yes, there was. I was, I tell the story often, but there was a, a dad in our programs who was, was trying to give his kid a choice to get out of the bath. You know, kids like they don’t want to get in the bath and then they don’t want to get out of the bath. But he said, okay, well, you can have, you know, he learned this in class. He was like, you can have five more minutes or, and we can have time for books tonight. Or you can stay in the bath for five more minutes. And we won’t have time for books or less books or whatever it is. And so he chose to stay in the bathroom. He goes into his bedroom later and he’s going to bed and he’s gets his books out. And his dad’s like, no, remember you made that choice. You’re responsible for your decisions. And you know, we can try again tomorrow. And he was crying and crying and he called his, his dad tucked him in, closed the door and he’s still crying.


He calls him back and he says, dad, dad come back. And his dad’s like, what’s going on? And he’s like, I’m just so sad as he’s weeping crying. And his dad said, you know, before this type of work, you would have been like, well, tough that’s life. That’s what happens when you make a wrong choice. And instead he just quiet it up. And he said, well, you know about what? And he goes about the choice that I made Because it was, I love that story because it’s just like, yes, we get to teach our children that they get, they are responsible. Right. It’s not us as the almighty controlling force that is making them good humans. It’s like, they are going to make mistakes and they are responsible for their own decisions.


Right? Like intrinsic responsibility, intrinsic motivation. It’s so good. So man, that’s a good framework.

Terry:
And I love the, you know, that everything is rooted in asking yourself, is this creating more wisdom? I think that’s a beautiful place to just kind of like for people listening right now, because you know, you can listen to a podcast. I mean, even, you know, taking classes and things like that, you know, it takes a little while to settle in and then you’re in the heat of the moment and, you know, emotions flare up and people usually just go back to their default. But I think if, if everybody listening can just like start there, like, I think that’s that, that’s amazing. Cause that’s, that’s one of those things, like you said, I think most people in the room would, would raise their hand. Hey, do you want to remain connected and, and have some sort of wisdom formed from what we’re learning here or this discipline that we’re going through, versus it just being a, oh, every time I do this, I something hurts and then hoping, and then hoping that over time, that nets out into a wisdom or connection or some sort of lifelong journey to where you actually became the type of parent that, that God sees in you, you know?


Cause you know, whether it’s parent, whether it’s anything in the world, God sees you above where you are like. So I think if everybody can, can reach for what that, what that thing is. And I think that was a beautiful statement that you said, it’s like, yeah, I think God did make me a parent to impart wisdom on my kids. Not just to be an electric fence. Right?

Wendy:
Yeah. Wisdom, life skills, mentorship teacher. Like those are all ones that I try to pull on when I’m like extremely triggered.

Terry:
That’s such a simple one though, for me to like next time I’m feeling it like kind of, whoa, okay. Where are we going? It’s like, okay, great. Is ask myself, this is this step I’m about to take or is this what I’m about to do? Will it impart any wisdom? Will one of our kids really be able to step forward and understand and even collaborate to some degree on like, oh, next time it’s like, I felt like I went through this with you and we worked it out together. And again, like you said, we might not have, you know, agree. It still might be awkward. You still might feel like you’re on two sides when it comes to whatever the issue at hand is.


But at least you’re like, okay, cool. We’re stepping forward in this together.

Wendy:
Well, yeah. What were you going to say, John? Cause the thing real quick, the thing about discipline, the way you guys do it, the way we do it is it, it does always, you always come out pretty much 99% of the time on the same page. So what are we going to say job?

Chad:
Well, I think it’s the, it’s that initial response to like when, when I was shifting out of more controlling parenting, I would offer these punitive consequences and the consequences were typically out of my own anger or my own sense of control. They were not given in love. They might have come even from a loving place. I, I have good intentions about that, but it was usually a given a little bit more harshly. Like that’s not okay. And if you do that, no, you’re not, no you got out of the bathtub too late and no, we’re not reading the book.


No, because you said right. Yup. That’s what you get. Right. And so what, what I find oftentimes in coaching parents who are coming from that perspective and I’m moving into a different, you’re safe with me. You’re loved no matter what connection oriented first before correction. But I found that I didn’t know what to do. Like I knew all the things that I shouldn’t do and I would feel paralyzed at times. Like I knew this wasn’t okay, whatever my child might be doing. And I also knew that my response to it was not going to be what I wanted to do. And so I would sit and go,

Wendy:
Yeah. And then feel weak and permissive.

Chad:
Yeah. Yes. But here’s the thing. And I think it even speaks to the, the story is told with the boy having a regret about his decision, right. That I felt like the holy spirit would show up in those moments. And I was, I didn’t know what to do. And I was quiet and it’s like, the spirit would move in and convict and bring even wisdom into my kids. I didn’t know how much volume I produced or how much defensiveness I created in terms of my approach and my kids being defensive around that, that what, I didn’t know what to do. There were many times where it’d be like, daddy, I’m sorry.


Right. Or something like that. And you’re like, I couldn’t have coaxed that out of them if I tried. But there was a, there was a conviction that was taking place in my not knowing. And I’ve coached many parents who have said, wow, I didn’t even know what to do. I took a few steps back. I was trying to get myself under control. And then my kids started to kind of own up and fess up some of the things that I wanted to point out to them that they had done wrong. They started to tell me things that they had done wrong. And again, it’s, it’s not formulaic. I just, I wanna make sure that we’re, we’re talking about description, not prescription about what things can look like, but that was a powerful motivator for me to keep moving, keep digging in to, to the Lord and receiving grace and truth from, from him as well as working to impart that to my kids.


Well, Hey there families, I am pausing this episode to invite you to the free online workshop that I’m teaching this month. All about disciplining with compassion connection and from kindness, you can save your seat by heading to freshstartfamilyonline.com/discipline. I will tell you all about the dates and the times that I am offering for you to attend this free one-hour class with me. But when you come and hang out for an hour, you will learn three steps to building a strong, compassionate kind and firm discipline toolkit that works with kids of all ages. You guys, this was a life-changing for me when I truly and fully understood how I could take a break from the punishment mindset, that kind of misbelief of like where the heck did we get the idea that in order to make our kids behave better, we must make first, make them feel worse, such an odd cultural norm.


But so much of traditional punishment is kind of based in that mentality that kids have to pay the price well with compassionate discipline, it looks a lot different. So once you embrace a compassionate discipline mindset and you have creative, effective tools at your fingertips to really teach kids important life skills, it will change everything for you in your parenting walks. So head on over to freshstartfamilyonline.com/discipline to find out the dates and times, and to save your seat. I cannot wait to serve you and empower you through this one hour free class. I will see you there.

Wendy:
Yes, it is such a practice, right? I mean all of parenting, I mean all the way up until your kids are really, really developed adults. Like it is such a practice to an end, even in careers and marriages and friendships like to become comfortable with like not knowing, but to, to hold the space, so to speak right for the holy spirit to come in and guide you. Like, I’m just such a, I want to fix, I wanna run a rescue. I wanna, I want to solve it. And the, the emptiness, the space can be really uncomfortable. So I know I’ve enjoyed learning about that practice over the years. Cause it really does. It opens up the space for God to do his work.


So, so good. Okay. Well we, we have, we were going to talk about why connection during discipline is so important and what connect connected discipline looks like. And because of time chat, I think you guys have an incredible course called discipline that connects you have it in an audio version, which is like the most simplest way. It’s amazing that you guys offer it in the audio version, audible or whatever version, because I think it’s makes it really easy. So I think if it’s okay, because I know that course and it’s so affordable teaches all that. I’m going to skip right. To a question that comes in often that you kind of just mentioned and alluded to, right when you said, you know, I forget your exact words, but you said, you know, we have to be careful or full of care to like not do things out of anger right out of when we’re really upset.


Right. But like obviously to take that calming break, just to practice a self-regulation to leave room for the holy spirit to come in. So, you know, one of the reasons why we had originally scheduled this call was, was you guys had shared a, a podcast episode of ours called parenting with a humble servant heart. And it was such a blessing for you guys to share that with your community. Thank you. It was episode 85. If anyone wants to go back and listen to that, that Terry and I recorded, but someone had commented and it was the most beautiful comment that I think really sparked my heart to have a conversation and bring it encouragement in this area to listeners and in our community and your community too.


But they said, great. This all makes sense. But they said, can you help us understand like what we can do when our sisters and brothers of Christ or our family members, our neighbors, basically they say to us like they don’t endorse like, like whoppings or smacking upside the head with like angry. Like you’re the worst. Like I’m going to punish you now. Like that type of like angry right punishment. But instead endorsed calm, loving enforcements of pain and punishment as a godly got luck, godly, loving action. So this person went on to say, you know, I just don’t know how to respond to that.


I don’t know like what to say, because you know, I’ve learned from you guys, like that’s not the way it is. So I, I was praying about it. I couldn’t wait to encourage her and her. And then I went back and she had deleted the comment and which, which signaled to me that there is so much fear of judgment in our Christian community. And I, it, oh man, it like, it breaks my heart because it’s like, there’s fear of judgment. There’s there’s, there’s just like, there’s just a lot of tension around it. And then I’m going to read one more just to give you an example of how I know I get this question a lot. I know you get this question a lot, Chad, I’m sure in your practice, because this is just such a common Christian teaching that a fear for his pain, that type of stuff.


It w if it’s done in like a loving, godly, calm action after you’ve calmed down, that’s like the key to godly discipline. So let me read you one more that I got a beautiful mom wrote in, and she said, thank you. I’ve been listening to your podcasts forever and applying the principles for several years now. And it’s been life-changing. I am a Christian and I have had fellow Christians ask me about spare. The rod, spoil the child scripture, and even bring up the fact that the shepherds did use their staff rod to hit the sheep. If they were out of line, even to the points of shepherds would break the sheep’s legs. If they constantly did it listen to shepherd so that they had to be carried on the shoulders of the shepherd to be close to their voice, and finally learn to listen to them all the time.


Once their legs healed, this information came from friends and family members who were shaped farmers, all this to say they had, they say, the Bible does refer to the rod as spankings discipline. This has confused me greatly because I’ve heard from the positive parenting community, that their rod was used to guide the sheep and not physically harm them. I completely believe in not spanking because of all the research done and all of my learnings in the positive printing community. But what I, what can I tell fellow Christians who bring up that scripture? So I just thought that was like a good example of like how cause, cause I think one more thing.


And then I want to hear your thoughts. I have a lot of people in my community who are, like I said so onboard in our bonfire support program, foundations, core students, Jesus got a parenting students. They’re like, cool, I got it. And then when they’re triggered and they’re in like a Thanksgiving family setting or at church, right. When their kid is melting down at the nursery or whatever it may be, and they’ve got the fishbowl around them, like you said, they just freeze. And they’re like, oh my gosh, I don’t know how to respond. And I cannot even tell you how many stories I have had from students who are like, yeah, I handled it. And then later I got the talk of like, you know, you’re going to raise like that.


That’s like not what the Bible teaches us. Like, are you so with all that said, Chad, will you impart your wisdom and your encouragement on this subject? So parents can really just feel a little bit more confident and then of course get themselves into the discipline that connects chorus. I’m going to actually give our Jesus kind of parenting course to anyone who purchases you guys as discipline that connects course during the month of April. So it’s just going to be the best combination. I’m so excited for people to get in and like learn the actual, like how to, what does connected logical consequences look like? What does compassionate, connected discipline look like? But I’m going to hand the mic to you now.

Chad:
Yeah. Well those are passionate sorts of, you know, messages that we’re getting. And I think it, I think the framework, again, I just more guides so much of my thinking and response the parenting as well as difficult kinds of conversations. And so I think there’s a, it’s an important piece for me when I hear things like that first to just check my own spirit here and go, okay, you’re safe with me. This person is confronting me. Okay. And, and I might not feel very safe right now. So I’m thinking through, okay, so what’s going on inside of me. And I could oftentimes anticipate that these kinds of conversations are going to come again.


So I don’t have to be surprised about that, but what’s going on inside of me. And then, and then I’m also thinking through the lens of like, what’s going on with this person who’s saying this to me. Right. Which is really a connection when we talk about your loved, no matter what, it’s a question that we ask about our kids, like what’s going on with them. And it also, it oftentimes helps me develop a little bit of compassion for them. It’s like sometimes the people that say things the loudest and most emphatic, I think are asking a question rather than making a statement. And that’s something that I would hear when I was working with at risk teens. Some they’d make big bold statements and behind it, I would hear a question.


And so I like to try to get curious in those kinds of situations as well, and just say so, so tell me, you know, coming back to messaging, I might, I might just, so, so what messages do you want your kids to receive from you and what messages do you think that they are receiving from you? Has there been a time where you have incorporated the, the punishment and, and really inflicted pain where you thought, Hmm, that child probably didn’t receive that very well or that probably wasn’t the best sort of a way of dealing with that. I might also ask. So what other ways do you, what other methods do you use for consequences?


And if the answer is, no, this is the one we use, right? It’s corporal punishment. That’s what we do. You know, then that’s, that’s informative to me, but I, I think the, the, I, I like asking questions. Maybe it’s just my background or training or whatever, but rather than trying to get into it where I’m put into a defensive posture, I really want to come. And I want to ask some questions and be curious about those. I’ve got lots of stories of people who have said things to me. Like we tried it, you know, the corporal punishment. And here we are kind of talking about what works, right. What I discovered is that I was really getting, cause we spanked our kids early on that I was really mistaking obedience for fear-based compliance.


And so they were complying with me out of a heart of love for me, but because they didn’t want to get in trouble and they didn’t like that. And, but one child would just look at me and go, well, that would make me even more angry. So, so I think, you know, just in terms of a response to people saying that they just try to get curious with that. Tell me about this. Do you think that it’s a one size fits all? Is that prescriptive? What do you do with the versus just a few verses ahead of that, that say that if you are a glutton at a politicians party, you should hold a knife to your throat. Like what, what, how do you interpret that scripture and connected families?


We have a, we have a, an ebook on spanking, so perspectives on spanking and where we take, you know, really those really five areas that we look at. And we start to play that out a little bit. And you know, I, I read recently and I would need to go back to find what I, where I read it. But the passage that, or the, the quote that you offered about breaking a leg of a, of a sheep, I think it was offered in the fifties. At some point it kind of came up and became popularized. But what it was attributed to back earlier has actually been refuted. And so, you know, again, that’s that that’s like, okay, well we need to go find that research and bring that forward.


But I also would just ask parents, how does godparent, w w what has been your experience in how God treats you? How does he discipline you? And, you know, the, the verse that really caught me off guard was first Thessalonians, two, 11 and 12. And I I’d never read it through the lens of parenting, but Paul says for, you know that we dealt with you as a father deals with his own children. Oh my goodness. If anything should perk our ears and we go, wait a second, Paul is going to tell me how he dealt with his children.


And, and then he goes on and he just says, encouraging comforting and urging you to live lives worthy of God, who calls you into his kingdom and glory. Right? And so for a season of my life, I would lay my head on the pillow at night. And I would say, was I encouraging? Was I comforting? Was I urging right as a reflection about the heart that I have towards my kids. I think there’s also another piece for us as parents to, to, to take a deeper look at is like, what’s my motivation for this? Like, what’s underneath it. Is it my need for quick response?


Is it my need? So other people see me and go, wow, they really are good parents. Right? And this is the kind of thing that, that gets me seriously, seriously passionate as I’m sitting in church or at a Sunday school class, there’s a five-year-old boy that joins our table. He wasn’t in his own Sunday school. He’s with us. He sits remarkably quiet and you know, it was well-behaved beyond what I would ever expect. You know, very polite, the whole thing afterwards, a parent says, Hey, wow, what a great child, right? Oh my goodness. This child is just so well behaved at you are such great parents.


Right? And, and, and I just could not help myself in situations like that. And I said, well, Hey, just hold on a second. I don’t disagree with you at all. This was really a blessing that this child sat here so politely, and this, these parents, I know them. I think they’re really solid, you know, parents, but I just want to say this. If this child was misbehaving in this situation and was really struggling and distracting to all of us, the value that that child has, did not change one single iota and the parents value didn’t change at all. Either. There’s nothing about that behavior that, that we should look at and go, oh, that’s perfect.


Because what that’s going to do is it’s going to drive people who don’t have that child out of the church. You will get the message. This is an unsafe place to struggle. And if we need to look pretty and we need to look shiny and we need to look like we have it all together, we suddenly look nothing. Like the people that Jesus hung out with, he wasn’t hanging out with people like that. And the people that he was, he was harsh and critical to people who thought they knew it all and had it all right. He was very rarely. The only time he was harsh was Satan. Get behind me flipping tables over when the, when the temple was, was not, was being severely misused and Pharisees, who thought they knew it all and were trying to Lord their way over other people.


Otherwise his approach to adultery three times was different. Three different approaches to somebody caught in adultery. Right. And it was never condemning. It was never harsh. It was always the kind of response that was, Hey, this is serious, but I’m leading with compassion, but I’m also holding a boundary here. Hey, go and send no more right. Get out of this behavior. So I think, you know, those are, those are some things that, you know, I hear from parents. I just want to encourage parents that I think I woke up one day and I thought, I don’t know if this is going to ultimately bring about long-term behavior change for my kids, but I can tell you this, that I can respect myself in parenting through this lens.


It’s like, I’m respectable. I handled some crazy things today with disrespect coming at me in a respectable way. Did I let people get away with it? No. Going to hold people accountable. Right. But how did I respond? Was it dominating and controlling or was it with grace and compassion while still pointing towards accountability?

Wendy:
So good. Chad. It’s like what I’m hearing. All of it is so good. But I’m what I’m hearing is like, you know, in those moments when you’re like, how do I respond to this? It’s like getting curious, like finding some way to connect with them. Right. Like, you know, they’re, they’re probably trying to help me. They, they care. They they’re they’re, they would love to honor God and all that they do, They mean, well, and what’s going on for me? Oh, like, hello, fear. Like, hello, fear of judgment. Hello. Fear of catastrophizing. Like, what if I’m doing it wrong? Hello, fear. Right. Like there it is. And then that can take, you know, a minute or two in that, in that uncomfortable zone of quietness or whatever.


And then it’s like speaking wise, like, I’m always like, I want something to say. Right. So it’s like, I put it, but I just gathered for some of your words is possibly a response could be like, thank you so much for your input. You know, I’m working with, so-and-so a few organizations like connected families or frustrated family to lead with compassion and also hold firm boundaries with our children and I’m learning every day. So thank you for caring and thank you for your, for your input. And I’m really focusing on leading with compassion and holding firm boundaries. What do you think that would be received? Well,

Terry:
Yeah,

Wendy:
Because it’s like, I want them to be able to remember this. So,

Terry:
And if you’re, and if you’re concerned at all, I look to the heart and example of Jesus in everything we do, especially when we’re feeling lost in our parenting walk.

Wendy:
Right, right.

Chad:
Yes.

Terry:
Because I think your, your example, ultimately, like, it all goes back to him, it’s like, you know, I know you started with, you know, how does God parent us? And then it was like, okay, well, let’s, let’s then now use his son’s example of how he lived his life, how he, how he dealt with problems, how he came alongside of imperfect people, which we all are, which our kids are all just pointing back to that. So I’m sorry. I didn’t mean To off, but I it’s, like, I think that that’s, I know it’s not necessarily trying to win a debate or anything, but in a you’re looking for a thing to say, and I just, I, to me, he’s, you know, Jesus is the undeniable, like, you know, figure in the room here, you know, you can talk or you can debate over one piece of scripture, but this is the ultimate,

Wendy:
Well, it’s like six or seven, but, but yeah, there’s so many great resources now, too. Right? Like, so I think I like that. So thank you so much. Like I value this conversation. I value your input. I’m, you know, I’m working diligently to learn from, from connected families, frustrated family, to lead with compassion and hold for him, boundaries. Why always looking to Jesus for guidance or trying to mimic Jesus and all that. We do something like that. But then also maybe one more layer of like, I’d be happy to share the resources with you that we’ve found recently that have really changed our, because that’s where like the nitty gritty is, right. Like we have an hour podcast today.


Right. Like we can’t get into like, okay, well, how do you address, you know, how do you have like a, a conversation where you feel confident with like the spare, the rod spoil the child conversation. How do you get this scripture? How do you take this scripture? Right. And there’s a ton of them, right? There’s so many resources. I shouldn’t say there’s a ton of them, but for, to, to, to, to solidify, what I’m trying to say is I believe with all my heart, there is absolutely no advocacy for spanking in the Bible. And there are a few scriptures that are difficult or take is a journey to understand what they actually mean. That’s what I should say. When I say there’s a lot of scripture.


Right. But I love that the fact of ending it with like, Hey, I’m happy to share these resources with you. We did a course called discipline. That connects. It’s amazing. It’s really affordable. We also have like an ebook. What is the spanking ebook called again?

Chad:
Yeah. It’s just perspectives on spanking.

Wendy:
Perfect. And we have, we have a, an amazing, e-book called perspectives on spanking. I’d be happy to like, share that with you. We also did a course called Jesus kind of parenting like that. I think can bring confidence to the conversation without having to be like, well, let me get my education out here about how I feel about this scripture and how I’m going to refute it when we’re not pastors. Right. Like, but when we’re in our quiet times with the Lord and we study it and we understand it, it makes sense when we have guidance and mentors like you and Jim and Lynn and your entire team to help us look at those. Like, you just become more confident over time, but you got to get into the resources. Right. But so hopefully, hopefully that helps listeners to just know, like, if you’re triggered by it, it’s okay.


It’s okay. Like That’s just part of being human. It’s probably based, you know, and fear of X, Y, and Z, and connection with that person. We’re all brothers and sisters in Christ. We are all on the same page. As our pastor, Myles MacPherson from the rock says we are United in Christ. We are on the same page and it’s okay to have uncomfortable conversations. It doesn’t mean what you’re doing is wrong. It just means you have the opportunity to possibly be a light and not have to prove anything, but just stand strong in confidence of who you are and how you’re choosing to lead your family in Christ.


Well said, thing that I say, I think that sometimes we might need to draw boundaries with people who are just continuing to come at us. Right. Or it’s like, well, you know, I’d be happy to go through the online course with you, or let’s both read the perspectives on spanking ebook book. And again, looking for understanding as opposed to agreement is such a refreshing perspective for me, it’s like, oh yeah, let me just help me understand what you’re saying. And then I might repeat that. And you’ll suddenly, I think oftentimes find that there maybe the person might not be looking for understanding. They just want agreement. And it’s like, oh, we just probably won’t agree on this. And that’s totally okay.


It’s, it’s not a salvation issue. And so I think that that, that we might need to set boundaries. The other thing that, that sometimes surprises me a little bit is that, that we want to be very loving because oftentimes when that’s coming toward us, I don’t sense that there’s a lot of love, you know, like, like it’s just hardcore. This is the way it is. And if that’s the way it is and it’s coming to me, right. I just, I just really need to, like, I would with a child who is really pushing the buttons right now, get myself under control, what’s going on with this person. Right. And I just want to be loving in my response, but I also don’t want to keep coming back to getting, just beat up over and over and over about this.


But that’s always been an interesting piece to me is when people come at me really hard about something like that. And it’s like, I expect to experience the love of Christ in this. Like, if you’re offering correction for me, I really want to experience the love of Christ here that you care deeply for me. And you’re connected to me, not just the behavioral outcome that you find acceptable. Right. And it’s interesting that that kind of parallels, you know, the, the way that that discipline seems to, to come out, oftentimes

Wendy:
It’s so perfect. Because what you’re saying is that’s, it’s so much of it is the internal work, right. Which is the bottom of the period pyramid. Who are you in Christ? Like, who are we in Christ? Right. Like we are designed to be connected and loving and compassionate. And even when people disagree with us, like even when people maybe even like, really call you out on things, like I had a mentor who is someone I really look up to, like, she, you know, ended up like using that tool, corporal punishment, because she went to like another mentor and her mentor was like, I’m going to call you out. Like you are disobeying God by doing this.


And she didn’t call me. And I was so upset that she called me. But like those moments when you’re just like, wow, I am, I, there is a thing that goes off inside of me. And it’s like, in that moment, it’s not about what anybody else is telling you or advocating for. Or it’s often so much about the feelings you’re having inside about your own worth. What if I’m wrong? What if I make a mistake? What if people are judging me? And it’s just such a beautiful place to look at, like, whoa, like, even if I am wrong, even if I am being judged by people who is like, what is going on with me and God right now? Like, how does God see me?


How does, how am I going to be like, how am I going to eliminate light in this way? Like that’s who I’m designed to be. And it just, I could imagine that will be like a really good way for us to reset. So, so good.

Chad:
Talk about this for a long time. We can grab another cup of coffee.

Wendy:
Well, thank you so much for being just so willing, right. To like, have this conversation and bring this light to the world. Chad, we are so grateful. I know these conversations, like, it’s just so interesting because they can feel uncomfortable. And I just love like, obviously like as a marriage family, that’s what your marriage, family therapist, right. And a life coach, like we know that like when your body does this and your shoulders tense up, like, what is that? Like? There’s so much underneath of it. That’s about more than just, you know, having a different opinion about what scripture says. Like, and it’s just so fascinating. So I encourage listeners just to keep unraveling it, stay in the work, get yourself into the discipline that connects course.


There, there are audio courses always available. Again, we’re going to just gift our Jesus guide to parenting course to anybody that purchases the discipline that connects course audible audio version this month. Just shoot me an email and we’ll get you that. But thank you for being here, Chad, and thank you for being here.


All right. Well, praise God for connected families. Happy Easter month of the month. Yes. New life. I pray that everyone was blessed today by this conversation.

Terry:
This is awesome. Thank you so much, Chad,

Chad:
Thank you

Wendy:
For links and more info about everything we talked about in today’s episode, head to freshstartfamilyonline.com/122.

Stella:
For more information, go to freshstartfamilyonline.com. Thanks for listening. Families have a great day.


Alright, families, that’s a wrap. I hope you loved this discussion today. Just as much as we loved recording this episode for you. So remember I think the perfect compliment to go along with this conversation that we had today is our free for start family learning guide to how to design affective logical consequences at work. So head on over, if you haven’t already and grabbed that now at freshstartfamilyonline.com/disciplineguide.

If you have a question, comment or a suggestion about today’s episode, or the podcast in general, send me an email at [email protected] or connect with me over on Facebook @freshstartfamily & Instagram @freshstartwendy.

 

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